[skyesfury]

Originally Posted by schizophrena As to the grocery analogy - some people do not like being helped. When I was a young lad and worked at a grocery store - I have had people who denied my help when I went to ask them if they wanted help loading in the bags into their car or put their cart away for them. They wanted to do it themselves - for whatever reason it may be, it's not my place to tell them they can't say "no" or how they can say no.

There's a drastic difference between someone who does not like to be helped and disrespecting someone when they do help you. I don't always like to be helped, either. But when someone does help me, even when I did not want or ask for their help, I don't tell them they're a bad person or be disrespectful to them. That's just being a sh*tty person.

Originally Posted by schizophrena As to the whole entitlement issue - it stemmed from someone demanding that Carbonite hand off their creation to someone like Rythal because the users are basically entitled to having an up to date and running addon (which we, the community, may have the privilege - not the right to use). You are correct in the fact that the entitlement debate isn't directly related to Rthal, however it is related to Carbonite's post lots of people are so upset about. Please re-read the post (copied below, because I took the time to find it again and re-read it). Darkmalux is stating his opinion that if you don't have time to fix an addon - than you do not publish an addon. That is akin to a demand or an attempted statement of "fact" to which Carbonite responded.

That's not entitlement. That's asking the authors to do what's in the best interest for the add on and the fans of the add on. I can't go so far as to say it's "what's right", but it's far from entitlement. That word gets thrown around for most trivial reasons these days. The only people that are saying anyone is "entitled to having an up to date" add on are the people trying to make the mature and reasonable fans look bad. Some of the more the emotionally driven posts have "demanded" they hand it off, but I've found most of those didn't happen until AFTER the authors made their disrespectful post, stating that they no longer play WoW or even knew of a patch. Should the posts have been worded a bit less "demanding"? I won't argue with that. But surely you can understand how dismissed we felt when we saw that. They came across with the attitude of apathy toward not just the add on, but the fans as well. That they updated is great and all, but that doesn't excuse the what they said toward Rythal or that they practically admitted they don't care about the add on anymore.

Originally Posted by schizophrena Finally, I'm standing up here saying that I completely understand where Carbonite could be coming from. I do not find it an offensive statement, but one that they have made before and have to reiterate once again because people keep questioning them. The fact is, even after that statement, people are still calling for them to hand down the project and give it up freely. Why not just let Carbonite decide when they make that decision (as they have told us before they would when they make that decision) and instead of yelling and raising pitchforks and torches demanding them to do a specific action, those who want to leave just leave. A lot of the rest of us are willing to wait patiently and hope they get more time - or someone else creates a new addon from scratch that does better than Carbonite.

No one is debating that it's "their add on". What people are miffed about is how they reacted to Rythal's fan update in addition to them not even playing WoW or even knowing about the patch. Surely you can see how that comes across as "they've abandoned the add on". I've seen a lot of add ons abandoned over the years. The authors that never told the fans they've abandoned it weren't thought of very highly. Those that said to the fans "Hey, not playing wow anymore. just wanted to let yall know" ALWAYS received overwhelming positive feedback. Sometimes the author would even come back and reply again or choose one of the volunteers offering to take over the add on to handle it. No one, when they're being calm and rational, is demanding they hand it off. In fact, I've seen more requests (not demands) that they add Rythal to the team so he work on it in an official capacity than I've seen requests (and demands) that they just pass it on. It says a lot that the "official" update reversed a lot of the fixes that the fan update made. I've seen several posts over the years about things breaking that weren't fixed until Rythal's fan update. Things that were re-broken with the official update. The only pitchfork raising that's been going on is by people in an emotional state when they post.

I don't know how else to put all that. If you still can't see it, then I guess there's nothing else for us to discuss. Several people have pointed out the same things and in every case you've blindly defended their abhorrent behavior.