Quantcast AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5 - Page 3 - WoWInterface
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05-23-10, 03:55 PM   #41
MidgetMage55
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The problem here is your assuming blizzard had a problem with the function not the method. If they deem the overall function unacceptable then they will take the appropriate steps to break that as well.

I can see where someone can come to the conclusion that they broke it and are "hiding" behind the method justification (not your words specifically, more the general public consensus as to the "real" reason). I just don't see Blizzard needing to do so.
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05-23-10, 07:20 PM   #42
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The fact that the camera CVars are no longer accessible means that nothing can tell you precisely where to stand anymore - superimposed or otherwise.
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05-23-10, 09:00 PM   #43
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They could work with coordinates.
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05-24-10, 02:27 AM   #44
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Camera coordinates were only needed to draw the shapes so that they matched the 3d world. All the information AVR Encounters used is still available. You just can't draw it in 3d but a 2d map is very much doable or you can point an arrow to a safe spot. In fact there already is a mod being developed that does something similar to what AVR Encounters did but using a 2d map. Whether that goes against the new rules is still a bit up in the air.
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05-24-10, 03:00 AM   #45
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Maybe I wasn't clear enough - I was actually complaining that Blizzard were only taking these steps because of the addon's method and weren't looking at its function, which I believe is infinitely more significant. My moaning isn't going to help anything, though, so whatever.

Also, it's interesting that someone's already jumped to developing an addon like HudMap. It shows that the interface community will only settle for the best and will always find some way of getting the functionality they want, even if something like this happens.
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05-24-10, 03:15 AM   #46
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While it is possible they didn't look at the function, I would find it unlikely that this is the case. The method they chose to employ speaks to the desire to kill only a methodology.

Being that there are numerous addons that have been around longer (in some cases significantly so) that fall in to a similar category without using the same methods I'm inclined to believe that they do not care about anything else but the method in this case.

In the end, without a specific statement from blizzard saying we only looked at X and not Y all we have is a bit of guess work and our personal take on how blizzard runs things.
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05-24-10, 04:07 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by Wella View Post
It's a bit annoying that Blizzard are only banning it because it is superimposed onto the 3D world, rather than looking at what the addon provides and why that might be unacceptable, which is why I think this movement is out of order and should lead to the removal of many other 'big arrow' addons in terms of their similarity in function to AVR/E.
I am pretty sure that people at blizzard had a very close look at the addon
Maybe they have just an other taste of what is acceptable?
In fact they remove all addons that are similarity in function in the way that they change the 3d world.

Banning Bossmods that give hints in the userinterface would require changes to the addon api you don't want... that would cause lots of colletaral damage.
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05-24-10, 04:11 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Olog View Post
Camera coordinates were only needed to draw the shapes so that they matched the 3d world. All the information AVR Encounters used is still available. You just can't draw it in 3d but a 2d map is very much doable or you can point an arrow to a safe spot. In fact there already is a mod being developed that does something similar to what AVR Encounters did but using a 2d map. Whether that goes against the new rules is still a bit up in the air.
Originally Posted by Cairenn View Post
If we find that the AVR mod (or any mod attempting to replicate its functions) are usable after 3.3.5 we will take further, more drastic steps.
I guess we will find out If they don't like it they will probably lock down more functions in combat.

Last edited by dafire : 05-24-10 at 04:13 AM.
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05-24-10, 08:54 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Wella View Post
Also, it's interesting that someone's already jumped to developing an addon like HudMap. It shows that the interface community will only settle for the best and will always find some way of getting the functionality they want, even if something like this happens.
Originally Posted by Olog View Post
Whether that goes against the new rules is still a bit up in the air.
HudMap isn't being developed in response to the AVR ruling.

If you go to the wowace.com project page for the addon you will see the project was started on the 10th of May. The thread with the Blue ruling about AVR was posted on the 20th of May , a short time after a few addon programmers noticed something to do with Camera pitch CVARs on the 3.3.5 PTR and had contacted Blizzard about it.

Now unless Adrine's learnt how to time travel 10 days back in time then it would be fair to say the HudMap was not started in response to the AVR ruling. To be fair thou the HudMap addon is actually an extension of a feature of SexyMap just expanded into it's own addon.

I feel I should point out at this stage HudMap is being developed by Adrine the guy responsible for Omen , Threat2.0 , Chatter, SexyMap and SexyCooldown. I think he knows full well the consequences of something like this and has worked in closely with the wow ui developers in the past. He has contacted Blizzard to ask if his project is OK or not and he he gets notification that it's not he will end the project.

So far he has yet to receive that confirmation.
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05-24-10, 08:55 AM   #50
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Just fyi, HUDMap is not being developed as a "replacement" to AVR or to counteract Blizzard's breaking of AVR. HUDMap was a part of SexyMap for... a year or two. And Antiarc started pulling it out into its own addon a couple of months ago.

edit: Also, Antiarc has contacted Blizzard to see if HUDMap is okay with them. If not, he'll pull it.

/editedit: bah, Blu beat me.
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05-24-10, 09:48 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by Seerah View Post
/editedit: bah, Blu beat me.
It's ok. You provided better timings then me.

pfft. Time travelling addon authors ?. Rather silly thought TBH

Al-tough. Might of been useful for those all nighters :

*zip back one day*
*submit new fixed commit from day ahead*
*go to bed*
*zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz*
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05-24-10, 10:28 AM   #52
Torhal
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Adrine? It's Antiarc.
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05-24-10, 11:15 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Torhal View Post
Adrine? It's Antiarc.
He posts under the Adrine name on the UI / Macros forums.

Go do a forum search
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05-24-10, 12:45 PM   #54
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Bah. You're right. It's been awhile since I visited the official forums.
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05-25-10, 06:31 AM   #55
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I see, my mistake. Thanks for the tip.
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05-29-10, 01:22 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by Galtar View Post
YAY about time. Why the hell would I want something to tell me how to play? Addons are great, but those that "tell" you what to do is unwanted.

I want to enjoy the game, not be an autonomous robot.
I find your fail logic amusing.


Originally Posted by Shadowed View Post
AVR was superimposed onto the 3D world, it broke the barrier between the game UI and the 3D world, something that is already frowned on with things like texture modifications.
Could you clarify, does AVR manifests its output as mere UI frames with textures that are a warped to match perspective?
Therefore at the same level as the oUF_HealLines i adapted from a couple other mods....

I mean there isn't some new API that lets you actually draw on the 3d world.

Last edited by jadakren : 05-29-10 at 01:32 AM.
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05-29-10, 01:38 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by jadakren View Post
I find your fail logic amusing.



Could you clarify, does AVR manifests its output as mere UI frames with textures that are a warped to match perspective?
Therefore at the same level as the oUF_HealLines i adapted from a couple other mods....

I mean there isn't some new API that lets you actually draw on the 3d world.
Its much like comic books when characters make references to them being in a comic. Known as breaking the 4th wall. It breaks the "illusion" of the game world by having graphics that are superimposed over it and keep perspective with your camera and motion.

While not physically in the 3d world it interacted (for the most part) as though it was. Blizzard as we have seen did not like this.
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05-29-10, 11:02 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by jadakren View Post
I find your fail logic amusing.



Could you clarify, does AVR manifests its output as mere UI frames with textures that are a warped to match perspective?
Therefore at the same level as the oUF_HealLines i adapted from a couple other mods....

I mean there isn't some new API that lets you actually draw on the 3d world.
Strictly speaking, AVR is draws in the 2D world. It does some math magic using the camera info to figure out how to transform a 2D texture to appear as if it's 3D. That's why AVR can't accurately draw a correctly sized texture over stairs, because it has no knowledge of where, or even if stairs exist.
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05-29-10, 03:59 PM   #59
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I personally use very little "helpful" addons. Most addons I use is just to make my screen look pretty and cause I forget to bring out my pet I use one for that. ^_^

I saw AVR. In order to go on a raid once it was required I downloaded it. I immediately disliked it. I pay blizzard to play this game, why would I pay to not play it now? That's kind of how I see it. I immediately deleted the addon and I'll never use it.

I understand why some people defend the addon.

"For people who don't raid, it helps them gain the knowledge of raiding"
"Some people just are not as good as others so they need the help"

But I don't see it as help I see it has hindrance. If you have something telling you what to do, you're not really learning, just avoiding to learn. They become dependent on this addon, and if it wasn't there, I don't think they would be as good.

Kind of like math and a calculator. If I use the calculator to do all my math for me, how will I ever learn what 2+2 is?

But that's just my personal opinion. ^_^
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05-31-10, 06:30 PM   #60
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Upon second thought over the whole 'It helps rookies' argument, I realised that it is probably better to do research on a raid before you do it for the first time, isn't it? You could watch some videos which guide you through the raid and all its major encounters (don't TankSpot do good videos like this?) or just ask some friends about it. This would then give you an actual knowledge of the whole raid, rather than just following some arrows, which might help some players, but I have the feeling that an awfully large majority of new players would end up relying on it and not using their own brain. I would probably fall into that trap.
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WoWInterface » Site Forums » News » AVR Mod Broken in 3.3.5

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