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05-30-09, 06:38 AM   #1
pbean
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Feedback on MMOUI Minion

Hai,

I like the Minion so far, as it basically does what the Curse client does (which I have used in the past and still use) and enables those extra features for unpaying customers (or rather, not limits functionality).

However, here are a few points that came to my mind while installing & using this application, maybe these points are useful for you for improving your product in the future:

- First of all, the installer installed the application and then just quit. While the application was installing, I was doing something else so when I came back I was confused and thought it had crashed. Then I reinstalled and spotted the installation directory, went there and opened the application. It was a long while later I noticed the icon on the desktop, and was enlightened. Perhaps it's an idea to either install a shortcut on the start menu as well (that's where I personally, and a lot of other people, look for installed programs). In addition to that I think it would be a very good idea to show a pop-up at the end of the installation indicating how the application can be started (eg. "An icon has been placed on your desktop"), after which the installer closes.

- Upon running the application, it showed that several addons were out of date, while in fact they were up-to-date. These addons were previously installed with the Curse client, which also reported they were up to date. In fact, it showed that version X (eg. 1.14.1 for Atlas) was available, while that was the version installed. Perhaps this is a bug, or perhaps this is intended behaviour?

- The donate icon is hideous and very vague. I didn't understand what the icon was at first, so didn't dare click it. Only after I clicked it out of curiosity, it showed me the donate window. I recommend a different icon (for example one with a coin on it, or a dollar sign). A tooltip wouldn't hurt either.

- For some addons, the description in the search window is garbled. One example of this is "Fubar AmmoFu". Not sure what it shows, but it's really weird.

- I am not sure how you implemented the search in that same window, but in my eyes it's kind of dodgy. For example typing "vampwatch" will not yield "FuBar_VampwatchFu" as a result, while typing "ammo fubar" does (probably because it searches for ammo OR fubar). I guess it's self evident that this needs some tweaking.

- Are the ads that appear screened? I just got one with a white background and red text, with some kind of red bar moving over it like crazy. Also several other ads with heavy animation have appeared. This is very annoying, and in the case of the red moving one, I was unable to normally use the application as it drew the focus of my eyes all the time.

- Sometimes the progress bars of certain addons are visible (in the main window), while not displaying any progress. I am not sure why they are visible and what their purpose is, so it's kind of confusing.

- As with most Java applications, this application doesn't fit 100% into my Windows (XP) environment. Some stuff just looks a bit out of place, a bit weird compared to native applications, etc. Perhaps some work could be done to ensure greater integration, for example by using standard UI elements (the vertically aligned tabs on the Options dialog is just weird).

- Talking about the Options dialog, it would be handy to display a number of how many update threads I have actually chosen. On the slider it says 1 and unlimited, but the slider is halfway now... how many threads have I specified? :-)

- Also the "Display Totals" caption should just be what is in the tooltip, as that would fit in the dialog and explains it way better (making it more clear more easily, without having to hover over it).

- On the "MMOUI - WoW" tab it has some login information, but it's unspecified what this login information is for (I suspect for the WoWinterface website, but I am unsure). Also using the OK button is no different from using the close button of the window ("X" in the top-right corner on Windows), so perhaps it should be called "Close" (I had expected that closing the window wouldn't apply the changes, while pressing the "OK" button would).

- The Options dialog has no window title, while it says "MMOUI Minion Configuration" in a label in the window itself. ;-)

- After closing the Options dialog, the addons always re-check for updates. I am not sure why this happens. It happens even after no changes have been made.

- Which brings me to another point... there's no way to manually check for updates? No refresh button or something similar? (Only Update All, but nothing to check for updates without actually updating them).

- The "OK" button in the Manage Ignored Interfaces dialog doesn't work. Also this dialog doesn't close with the ESC button on the keyboard.

- Perhaps it's neat to put it am internet browser window which would appear when you click More Info, to display the page in that browser.

- As with many applications, the "File" menu only contains the "Exit" action, while the keyword "File" has nothing to do with exiting the application whatsoever. Perhaps you should drop the "File" menu, and just let "Tools" be the first menu item. Then extend it with a separator and an "Exit" action on the bottom.

Well this is my extensive list of feedback that I have for your little application. I hope you can use some of these points to improve your product.

Please don't get me wrong, I totally love your initiative and think the application is already great in Beta and can only get better for the final release, above points are just my feelings about it. Good luck with further development!
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05-30-09, 06:46 AM   #2
pbean
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Join Date: May 2009
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In addition to those points, there are two I just came up with as well.

- To me it's kind of unclear what the mode of operation of Minion is. The Curse client, for example, stays in the background all the time and informs me when an addon can be updated. However in my eyes it seems that Minion is an application which is started, operated, and then exited, but I'm not sure.

- In this case, wouldn't it be great to have some sort of button bar to start games with, and closing the application also. For example "Start World of Warcraft" would start WoW and close Minion. Then I would just start Minion, update addons when necessary and then start WoW, instead of having to click separate icons.
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05-30-09, 11:48 AM   #3
Zyonin
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From what I can tell, Minion is a launch, use, and exit application, not one that stays resident in the background. This would be in line with it's "I don't do things until you tell me to" mode of operation.

If you wanted a launcher type of function, that could be another small module that could handle game launcher duties. Those who want this function could then add the module, those who want lean and mean operation could pass.

Regarding the annoying ads. Please note what ads they are, your locale (what ads you see will depend on were you are located in the world). Then send those ads and your location to Cairenn so she can scream at the ad provider.
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06-09-09, 05:35 AM   #4
peewee_sweden
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-A filter for the addons list would be appreciated as well, I don't need to see all the addons that are updated by installing/updating another addon. Being a user of PitBull, Quartz and QuestGuru, the list of addons updated through other means gets very long =)
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06-10-09, 03:52 PM   #5
Halkale
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To be honest I never use Curse as open all the time. When I sit down each day I turn on Curse, let it check, the close it once done. I like that in an addon manager.
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06-15-09, 04:11 PM   #6
Nosforat
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I take it since there is not much feedback on this its not being well received.

As it stands now. Its unusable for me. The addons its telling me need to be updated are already updated and the others are not detected. Furthermore there is no indication of installed version. I really hope the next update will be coming soon but I have to say up to this point I'm not holding my breath.

The fact that the "Daily update Thread" has not been updated since June 4th does not look good. I was really looking forward to this tool but my interest is faulting.

I must admit that I still lunch it daily just to see if it has been updated. But is useless in its current form. I'm stuck with curse client atm. At least that is working to some extent.
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06-15-09, 05:00 PM   #7
ScytheBlade1
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@pbean: yes, I've noticed a lot of these myself.

Originally Posted by Nosforat View Post
I take it since there is not much feedback on this its not being well received.
I'd disagree with that.

Originally Posted by Nosforat View Post
As it stands now. Its unusable for me. The addons its telling me need to be updated are already updated and the others are not detected. Furthermore there is no indication of installed version. I really hope the next update will be coming soon but I have to say up to this point I'm not holding my breath.
Addon detection is a problem that is being worked on. It isn't a trivial thing to do.

Originally Posted by Nosforat View Post
The fact that the "Daily update Thread" has not been updated since June 4th does not look good. I was really looking forward to this tool but my interest is faulting.
Shirik, the program lead (and until yesterday, the ONLY developer) is currently working 10-12 hour days. That would be why updates have been lacking.

I'm not about to make promises concerning updates, but yesterday Shirik gave me bug tracker and source access. While I can't promise bug fixes and I have no power to make releases, at least there is now someone other than just Shirik working on this. (And no, I'm not the first and only 'new helper'. He's still looking for volunteers, but to be honest his schedule is limiting even his ability to talk to volunteers, from what I can tell.)
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06-15-09, 10:11 PM   #8
Shirik
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The daily update thread is now defunct and should be removed. It was intended for updates up to the start of beta.

Beyond that, I'm not really going to respond to your recent comments as I don't think you'd really like what I'd have to say to them. Scytheblade1 already said most of the important things.

P.S. If you would actually take the time to look at the roadmap, you'd notice the things you're complaining about are already scheduled for the next version. Sometimes you just have to take the time to look for yourself. I'm not here to hold everyone's hand.
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06-16-09, 08:41 AM   #9
macnda
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Firefox and Minion

When I tried to go from link to minion page it kept freezing up. I also tried just copying link location, closing out other windows ...still froze up,not sure if this is a FF problem, Minion or something with just mine. I ended up downloading from IE. also tried Chrome and Opera. no issues getting to it. What I see so far I like, though there are the same problems others have with dueling updates (Curse says it updated. Minion says it needs to). Also I am hoping you will put in a link back to original mod when looking for new addons, this helps when deciding on putting some in.
I did notice on a couple addons it said "couldnt delete warcraft file" Kind of had me nervous doing it.. but Have faith in you all. Thank you all for the time and effort putting this together.
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06-16-09, 01:52 PM   #10
ScytheBlade1
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Originally Posted by macnda View Post
When I tried to go from link to minion page it kept freezing up. I also tried just copying link location, closing out other windows ...still froze up,not sure if this is a FF problem, Minion or something with just mine. I ended up downloading from IE. also tried Chrome and Opera. no issues getting to it. What I see so far I like, though there are the same problems others have with dueling updates (Curse says it updated. Minion says it needs to). Also I am hoping you will put in a link back to original mod when looking for new addons, this helps when deciding on putting some in.
I did notice on a couple addons it said "couldnt delete warcraft file" Kind of had me nervous doing it.. but Have faith in you all. Thank you all for the time and effort putting this together.
That sounds like a problem with the Java applet in your browser.

http://minion.mmoui.com/minion.jnlp

Does that link start a java installer?

Also, if you have an older computer, that "locking up" might just be java starting up. Let it sit for a good minute (or two, even) if that is the case.
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06-23-09, 05:20 PM   #11
deke913
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Having just now installed the program and used it for the first time, I have to say I am pleased with the results. Admittedly I was a big fan of WM and used it daily. This seem to fill that slot nicely even tho its only beta. Very nicely done guys, this can only get better as you go...thanks for your hard work and good luck.
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06-23-09, 07:38 PM   #12
Sazdek
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liking it so far (just downloaded it about 10 minutes ago)


im not sure if this was in the works for the future or if it's posted anywhere, but i'de like to suggest an option that cleans out your old saved variables (ones that no longer match an addon in your interface folder) and for addon search i'de like it to show all available addons then have them filtered down. yes these are obvious rip offs of the WM features, but that was essentially the only reason i even used WM.


keep up the good work guys
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06-23-09, 08:13 PM   #13
Seerah
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Glad to hear it's working out for you guys!

Yes, these have been suggested already before, and are good ideas. Technically, they were originally implemented by the old WowAce Updater (WAU), which WM took the idea from. But anyhow... You can check the tracker for any suggestions that have been submitted, submit your own, or comment on bug/suggestion tickets: http://www.mmoui.com/bugs
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06-24-09, 04:48 PM   #14
nonameform
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I've been using the outdated WoWInterface UI Manager for quite some time and I was excited when Minion was first announced. When the beta version was released, I've tried using it to update my addons, but eventually I've uninstalled it.

So far I had no problems with WoWInterface UI Manager, even though there is a caveat on download page about it being discontinued and being beta software too. Still in my opinion it has more intuitive interface and it has one important feature which I believe isn't in Minion at the moment. I'm talking about backups.

While running Minion last time I've accidentally clicked "Update all" button and all of my recognized and not up-to-date (according to Minion) addons were overwritten. Since I like at times to modify source code of the addons a bit it was not the most pleasant thing to happen to me. I was happy to know that at least my old backups were still intact, so I was able to recover some modifications I've made to the addons, but that turned me away from Minion.

WoWInterface UI Manager even if it's outdated has that fool-proof update system that requires you to do many clicks, so you have time to actually save files you need. But even if you don't save them, it creates an automatic backup (naming of the files sucks though, when you try to browse them manually).

I do recognize that some people might not even need that sort of functionality, but just the piece of software to update their addons with one click of a button. WoWInterface UI Manager isn't perfect. It shows errors, when addon on site is being updated, sometimes it might not be able to update addon because it finds an error (though it's easy to fix by doing a rollback to older backup or removing addon folders from Interface directory). One other thing that might seem like a flaw to someone else is that if you have installed addons, you might need to actually register them, providing addon ID from wowinterface.com. I find it useful though, as I don't need to decline updates for addons that I download from curse.com or wait for some strange "Waiting for addon X..." messages that I saw in Minion, even though addon X is on not-to-be-bothered-with list.

Hopefully Minion will eventually be fixed and developed into more flexible tool. I've had similar experience about a year ago with Curse client which "updated" some of my addons with outdated versions, even though new versions were available on site and I've installed them manually prior to downloading the client. Needless to say, I just preferred to uninstall the client and continue to manually update addons until I switched to wowinterface.com and the aforementioned updater.
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06-25-09, 01:02 AM   #15
ScytheBlade1
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Originally Posted by nonameform View Post
Hopefully Minion will eventually be fixed and developed into more flexible tool.
First off, thanks for your feedback. It is always appreciated.

Second, there are numerous fixes that need to go in. Our bug tracker (linked within the stickes) is pretty much overflowing; as of right now there is a tight squeeze on manpower, but things are slowly looking up.

Third, if you'd like help - please reply here with a log file attached (information for that is, again, in the stickies on this board) or if you think there is a good chance we don't know about the issue, post it on the bug tracker. We'd be glad to help.

Lastly, yes, it needs... polish.
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<Thunder_Child> ah, nothing makes me think of WoW more than seeing 15 different addons telling me i dont know how to play
<End> Well, I'm not an AddOn, but you don't know how to play
--
<Iriel> does your 'therapy' involve pitchforks and boiling oil?
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