Addon Author Practices

[Petrah]

Originally Posted by Maul I could also see the addon sites like WoWI or Curse removing addons that have websites that support activities that violate the EULA or ToU. /2 cents

There's the rub. The addon in question has not broken any policies/TOU/EULA, so they can't really do that I wouldn't think.

[Maul]

Originally Posted by Silenia There's the rub. The addon in question has not broken any policies/TOU/EULA, so they can't really do that I wouldn't think.

The "official" site of the addon is promoting an activity that violates the Terms of Use for users. So, guilty by association. I myself am not calling for removal of the addon from any site. I am just saying that it could happen to maintain the integrity of the site in Blizzard's view.

The point of my post is "Why?". Why would an addon author do something that could potentially get Blizzard upset and thus perhaps spread to the official WoW Fan Sites (addon sites) having to remove their addon while also having the addon potentially blocked from loading? Whether people think it or not, Blizzard takes the whole gold selling business in a very, very dim view. Why poke a stick at the bee's nest?

If an addon author wants to be a rebel, so be it. If being a rebel messes with Blizzard's product in any way, shape or form, just don't be surprised at the backlash Blizzard may dish out. Blizzard has proven to not be shy in this regard.

[Petrah]

Originally Posted by Maul The "official" site of the addon is promoting an activity that violates the Terms of Use for users. So, guilty by association. I myself am not calling for removal of the addon from any site. I am just saying that it could happen to maintain the integrity of the site in Blizzard's view. The point of my post is "Why?". Why would an addon author do something that could potentially get Blizzard upset and thus perhaps spread to the official WoW Fan Sites (addon sites) having to remove their addon while also having the addon potentially blocked from loading? Whether people think it or not, Blizzard takes the whole gold selling business in a very, very dim view. Why poke a stick at the bee's nest? If an addon author wants to be a rebel, so be it. If being a rebel messes with Blizzard's product in any way, shape or form, just don't be surprised at the backlash Blizzard may dish out. Blizzard has proven to not be shy in this regard.

Absolutely.. I agree.

Blizzard can, if they so choose, have that site shut down. They are promoting the sale of a copyrighted item. The gold selling sites have no legal right to sell something that belongs to Blizzard, and the owners of DBM have no legal right to promote such illegal activities, much less make revenue from it.

Edit: After thinking about it, had to add that ^. I was wrong in my previous statement.

[septor]

Advertisements will be taken down by the 15th, according to this post: http://deadlybossmods.com/forum/view...hp?p=4053#4053


Author issued an apology to the community in this post; http://deadlybossmods.com/forum/view...hp?p=4264#4264

[Petrah]

So they're going to stop breaking the rules on the 15th because the banner ad is paid for up till then?

/has a "is it just me?" moment....

[us2006027321]

Originally Posted by Silenia So they're going to stop breaking the rules on the 15th because the banner ad is paid for up till then? /has a "is it just me?" moment....

It's not just you, and I'm inclined to agree with you that the fact that they are "just" breaking the ToS and EULA until the fifteenth doesn't mean they aren't still breaking the rules. Really all of this comes down to what bottom line you want to draw. The conflict here is what one thinks is more important: retribution for a violation of agreed regulations or the fact that they are going to stop violating them eventually. I'm with you that them pulling down the banner on the fifteenth doesn't make it okay, and in fact, I think it makes it kind of worse. Their attitude screams, "We don't care about the rules enough to take a loss and fix it now. We paid for our rule-breaking through the fifteenth, and we're going to continue breaking them until then." On the other side of our they-should-get-punished coin, they are going to stop eventually, and perhaps we should be willing to call that good enough. If this were a picture-perfect world, I'd be all for giving them a good kick in the bollocks for having broken the rules, and they'd likely get it, too. (In a picture-perfect world, they'd not have broken the rules. ) Unfortunately, this is not such a world, and corporate entities as they are, I don't think we should expect them to behave like they're in one.

[Cairenn]

Guys, honestly, dial it back.

I think a lot of the problem that is going on here of late is: because there has been so much drama over the last couple months that people don't know how to deal with it when there isn't any. It's like someone that has chronic pain (I can use this analogy, because I live it every day). The body becomes so used to living with pain, that when there isn't any pain, the body is going "something's wrong". Or possibly comparable to an adrenaline-junkie. The drama gives a person an adrenaline rush (anger/frustration/upset causes a lot of the same endorphins, since it's preparing the body to deal with the instinctual "fight or flight" self preservation mode), that when that adrenaline isn't there the body craves more. (There's a reason Cairenn loooooooves roller coasters! )

As for why they would be leaving the ad in place until the 15th, that's blatantly obvious. [I would imagine that] They have a contractual obligation they have to honour, unless they want to go to court over it. They screwed up [in the eyes of many people in the community (whether they actually did or not is a different debate), they apologized, they said they will remove it when they [legally] can.

[Seerah]

I would also like to just remind everyone of our stance on no bashing other sites/people while on this site (you can go there to do that). We've been toeing the line in this thread, and I know that I came close, too. I just wouldn't like to see the line get crossed. We just need to remember that this thread is about the practices in general - DBM is just being used as the current example.

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by Silenia There's the rub. The addon in question has not broken any policies/TOU/EULA, so they can't really do that I wouldn't think.

For me an interesting line of enquiry would be :

Does Blizzard specifically state that Gold Selling is against policy/TOU/EULA ?

Is there a specific bit of contractual law stating that a WOW player must not buy gold ?

Because if not then technically the DBM website isn't breaking any of Blizzard's laws/policy/TOU/EULA.

It would then have to be evaluated on a case by case.

Should Blizzard have any say in how a website operated outside of game operates ?

Please I don't mind if you guys call me a fool for bringing this up. I'm just waxing lyrical here ... chewing the cud as you will

[Maul]

From the ToU -

11. Ownership/Selling of the Account or Virtual Items. Blizzard does not recognize the transfer of WoW Accounts or Blizzard Accounts (each an “Account”). You may not purchase, sell, gift or trade any Account, or offer to purchase, sell, gift or trade any Account, and any such attempt shall be null and void. Blizzard owns, has licensed, or otherwise has rights to all of the content that appears in the Game. You agree that you have no right or title in or to any such content, including without limitation the virtual goods or currency appearing or originating in the Game, or any other attributes associated with the Account or stored on the Service. Blizzard does not recognize any purported transfers of virtual property executed outside of the Game, or the purported sale, gift or trade in the "real world" of anything that appears or originates in the Game. Accordingly, you may not sell in-game items or currency for "real" money, or exchange those items or currency for value outside of the Game.

Anyhow, it seems the DBM site is doing the right thing A public apology goes a long way in making an issue fade into history.

[Petrah]

Originally Posted by honem For me an interesting line of enquiry would be : Does Blizzard specifically state that Gold Selling is against policy/TOU/EULA ? Is there a specific bit of contractual law stating that a WOW player must not buy gold ? Because if not then technically the DBM website isn't breaking any of Blizzard's laws/policy/TOU/EULA. It would then have to be evaluated on a case by case. Should Blizzard have any say in how a website operated outside of game operates ? Please I don't mind if you guys call me a fool for bringing this up. I'm just waxing lyrical here ... chewing the cud as you will

You're splitting hairs. Also pretty please read the edit in my next post after that one.

The gold sellers are selling copyrighted intellectual property that belongs to Blizzard Entertainment. You can slice and dice it ten ways from Sunday and it will still be illegal. Anyone choosing to sign up and make revenue off of the illegal sale of copyrighted material is supporting that illegal activity and is just as guilty in the eyes of the law. Especially after knowingly realizing that it's illegal but continuing to do it anyway.

[zork]

If you don't want to buy WoW-gold for real cash, just don't buy it. If you don't want them to display WoW-gold advertise, pay their monthly fees so they don't need to advertise. Has nothing to do with morals its a business decision. Business is moral-free as the world economic crisis teached us already. Get real.

[Petrah]

Originally Posted by zork Has nothing to do with morals its a business decision. Business is moral-free as the world economic crisis teached us already. Get real.

While you are entitled to hold an uninformed opinion, you are not entitled to make stuff up and call it a valid argument.

[Benea]

I think everyone needs to chill out. After reading some responses, I had to double check that the topic wasn't about some atrocity of massive proportions on a global scale.

[Ackis]

Updated original post to reflect the apology :P