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10-02-11, 01:41 PM   #1
realista69
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Looking for help in designing and creating a awesome addon

Hello folks,

I recently came up with a dps add on which I really think may revolutionize the dps game in WoW. I need help from people interested in burning some time to help launch this idea. I will even go as far as contacting you direct and arrange a meeting to bring this idea up from the ashes.

Recent changes to the game have allowed for different coding to be used and I think its about time a Really Good DPS Add on hit the community.

Please only respond if you can read/write code and have a talent to birth a creation I strongly believe will grab gamers attention and keep them using it til the end.

Thanks for your time.

Realista
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10-02-11, 02:43 PM   #2
Haleth
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Considering we have some pretty solid dps meters out there already, I think a little more explanation wouldn't hurt here.
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10-02-11, 03:49 PM   #3
Seerah
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I'm curious what this
Recent changes to the game have allowed for different coding to be used
means, actually.
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10-03-11, 08:31 AM   #4
realista69
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Thank you both for your reply.

I will give a vague description of the add on here, but to get to the real benefits of the add on you will have to look at my diagram and schematics to fully comprehend its true nature as a DPS add on and then weigh its true benefit to the community.

The only trouble I have at all with revealing what this add on is supposed to do is giving away all the details and having the add on developed outside myself. The idea I have is sound, it will work on every spectrum of player regardless of how elite they maybe. Even some of the most elite players will like it while some others will discredit it, but rest assured the add on will improve a players game 10 fold - I am not exaggerating and really believe this will blow some folks away.

At its core the add on is a DPS version of Healbot. While this idea is nothing new, the add ons in the past have been extremely lack luster and mostly ineffective. I have created a template to be used and with some simple coding the beta of this add on could be launched. Those interested in assisting will be co owners of the add on, this add on will spawn a legacy that will reach far into the years and will be the staple of an addition which will most likely be replicated across every MMO, with WoW specifically in mind.

I am willing to spend the hours and currency to launch the add on, I need dedicated minds and an honest couple of techs to get involved. The project wont take more than 3 weeks to complete. The Beta would be launched and following bug reports the final version would be released. After 6 months this add on will need more assistance in staying updated and consequently donations will be requested - though this project is not intended to make anyone rich it will inevitably turn into a life long project to be managed by many others to come.

Please,

If you are interested all I require is some basic info which you could PM me with. I would need to know how experienced you are with addon modification, and what software tools you intend to use. As mentioned the add on is going to resemble and function similar to healbot but with a few modifications.

I truly am honest guy, and honest gamer and would appreciate your time and effort. Really and truly the implementation of this add on done right will blow away everything we have ever seen before.

Regards,

Realista
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10-03-11, 10:16 AM   #5
Haleth
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Forgive my being cynical, but you have no way to tell whether or not it will be a success. I've seen grand opening posts like this before, claiming to become something revolutionary, completely new etc., but there was never any real info given and none of the projects got off the ground.

If you want to get people interested, you should really post some more information - and even if you really have your mind set on "claiming" it before someone else does, which you seem to do, you'll still have made the original post and idea.

Regardless, good luck with it.
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10-03-11, 10:58 AM   #6
Grimsin
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If your going to pay me ill code anything you want
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10-03-11, 11:45 AM   #7
Seerah
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realista69, I mean no offense by this, but the last thread I saw of this nature (a week or two ago on the Blizzard forums), it was like pulling teeth trying to get out of the OP what they wanted the addon to do. He swore up and down that his addon idea was 100% possible and 100% legit. When we found out his idea, we had to tell him that it wasn't.

I'm not certain of your reasons for wanting to keep your idea a secret. Whatever floats your boat. But this here is a great community, and you're not doing yourself any favors by keeping this information to yourself. You have here a multitude of great minds at your disposal. If your idea is found worthwile, isn't that what you want - for someone to make it? Maybe 3 people will make it. Maybe none. Maybe the idea needs fleshed out more. Maybe the idea isn't really possible and/or feasible.

As to your vague discription... I have absolutely no clue as to what this means:
At its core the add on is a DPS version of Healbot.
If it means what I am left to interpret it as, I think your idea may fall into the "impossible and/or not feasible" area...

/edit: we have no intention of crushing your hopes and dreams! Just help us help you.
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10-03-11, 12:30 PM   #8
realista69
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Originally Posted by Haleth View Post
Forgive my being cynical, but you have no way to tell whether or not it will be a success. I've seen grand opening posts like this before, claiming to become something revolutionary, completely new etc., but there was never any real info given and none of the projects got off the ground.

If you want to get people interested, you should really post some more information - and even if you really have your mind set on "claiming" it before someone else does, which you seem to do, you'll still have made the original post and idea.

Regardless, good luck with it.
Thank you Haleth, I do not find your post the least bit cynical as a matter of fact I see your point. I will thereby reveal the details of the add on. I have a bit more to show but I would rather discuss the add on, rather than see it never evolve or become a reality.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Project DeepsBot

We would call the add on what would seem to be a fitting name: DeepsBot

The following add on would allow DPSers to simply click on 5 sections. Each section has a purpose which in essence like Healbot would allow a person whom is dpsing to simply click on the box which would act as a Focus button on a another players target in the raid.

For starters, there would be be three buttons with the center button being your primary use button. Assigned attacks would be selectable such as Healbot and would allow numerous attacks to be set with a simple click of the mouse. This Center Button would be larger than the other buttons for visibility.

To the left and the right of the Center player button would be one button to auto focus on the Tank 1 and his target. The button to the Right of the Center Player button would be for the Tank 2. Similar to Healbot there would be a spell timers which would show the duration of the attack and would visually allow the players to keep track of DoTs attacks which are on CD.

The add on would need to smart, knowing what class is using it and could be later allowed to install particular pieces for specific classes. Additionally the buttons would have to allow for the user to be able to designate which Tank is Tank 1 from Tank 2. (Blizzard already implemented a Focus option for Tanks)

Above and below the center button are two more buttons of equal size as the Tank buttons off the the sides. The Upper Button would be specially designed to show what Procs are available for the player. Not all Procs are visible and many gamers are actually using additional add ons to track these Procs. If it is a viable option I would like to even include a button within the Upper button to allow for quicker release of the available Proc the player might want to use in order to bring his DPS up. (Specials which WoW doesn't present on the display for players to easily recognize)

The Lower Button is especially important. This Button is made to either be a 3rd Tank button and/or a "Tab Everything BUT the Tank 1 and Tank 2's Target." Players who are no interested in DPSing Tank 1 or Tanks 2 Targets will get a faster picture of what ADDS in the game need to be killed.

Similar to the add on Taunt master the Center button would need to flash for a couple seconds indicating the player has aggro and needs to save himself. Lastly The Center Button would allow a player to click or Tab as they do to new target if they desired and can use the Center Button with or with out the use of the additional buttons. Only after the side buttons (Left, right and Lower) are clicked will it focus on the target, other wise they can choose freely by selecting their own targets and use the Center Button.

Advantages and Disadvantages for DeepsBot:

Advantage:

* Simple "on the fly" tab targeting saving players time while looking to DPS.
* Timers showing what spell is on CD and which need to be reapplied per tank or DPS member.
* Proc and special abilities indicator with an optional quick press button to initiate the attack.
* Threat meter recognition.
* Customizable set up for each class.

Disadvantage:

* Single point of weakness, in other words if a player or tank for that matter is not on the right target then the player using DeepsBot will and can be wasting valuable time DPSing. Though this may seem a disadvantage this may actually be an advantage - Why? B/c Now a DPS leader can be assigned to the Lower Button Focused Player and eliminate down time.(Especially if the DPS leader is a great gamer)

* Would require some players to be more of a clicker type dps rather than a keyboard spe******t, but then again that is the point of making this add to increase DPS numbers for the players who need to learn and fulfill their roles. Clickers will most usually always be prone to click on a target as they normally do - wasting time and not visualizing the spell Cool downs.

* May or may not be a resource Hog, but most computers are already running numerous add ons to fulfill some of the basic functionality of DeepsBot, turn them off and use this add on equals the same consumption.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the basic premise of the Add on DeepsBot. I would hope for constructive criticism here and would like to ask for help in developing the add on. Much of the Code already exists. Each button only needs to be written to satisfy their functions. While we may have a number of players saying such an add on would not be necessary I find that "most" of the player base are not experts gamers, most in fact are casual gamers. This add on would bring up players who might not be able to pull a satisfactory amount of DPS and achieve the victory they may be lacking due to output.

I have a strong belief that this would open up the game in a way that would put a semi casual player into a higher class of DPSer. If developed this add on would last the test of time and there would be a desire for many players to get a hold of it, even if they are keyboard pros they can at least benefit from all the added functionality.

Thank you for your time in reading this, I would like to request assistance in developing this add on : DeepsBot


Regards,

Realista

Last edited by Cairenn : 10-04-11 at 11:35 AM. Reason: fixed formatting - cairenn
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10-03-11, 02:25 PM   #9
Rilgamon
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As a tank I can tell you I dont want you to dps on my target.
I want you to dps skull, cross and so on. So mainly your addon would produce bots who dont see whats going on. Not an improvement from my point of view.
When it comes to programming there is no task open to program. Just setup bartender and you're done. The things that cant be done in bartender are 99% not easily done. And as you say for procs there are 100other addons.

I dont see your addon to fill the promises from your opening post
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10-03-11, 03:19 PM   #10
realista69
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Hmm... Skull, X and so on are usually associated with the targets tanks pick up.
So to say you don't really care for people to target your target kinda sounds illogical.

And as far as not seeing whats going on..I beg to differ. Folks will see your target in all its glory, they will learn and most likely will even be able to focus targets and stay raid aware. I only know of a few old school healers who don't use any add on to heal for example, so to say these folks who use such add on are Bot-like is also kinda demeaning to the player. Additionally players who use such addons are actually quite gifted.

To each his own. I wont argue opinion, the fact remains this is a utility which will eradicate the likes of bartender and the like. It is its purpose and easy or not to develop is certainly some the knowledge I am trying to seek.

You are entitled your opinion, but as expected many in the community who consider themselves above average wont ever see much a use for such and add on, its intent is for those looking to advance in the numbers game while staying aware.

/Edit: I looked up Bartender and it is very much not even close to what I had presented above, its functionality would trump the likes of such addons.

Last edited by realista69 : 10-03-11 at 03:41 PM.
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10-03-11, 04:38 PM   #11
Haleth
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If I interpreted your post correctly, your addon is essentially an all in one:

- Target manager with built-in threat meter
- Buff/debuff timer
- Reactive ability alert

It sounds interesting, but bear in mind that the target manager won't be possible. You see, buttons cannot have their function changed while in combat due to restrictions set by Blizzard.
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10-03-11, 05:11 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by realista69 View Post
Hmm... Skull, X and so on are usually associated with the targets tanks pick up.
What about bossfights were you don't have to target tanks target or wher you have to target a mob thet spawns infight? e.g. alysrazor, Lord, Conclave of Wind...
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10-03-11, 08:42 PM   #13
Grimsin
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If its going to make bartender obsolete it better include action bars too.
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10-03-11, 09:34 PM   #14
Rilgamon
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Originally Posted by realista69 View Post
Hmm... Skull, X and so on are usually associated with the targets tanks pick up.
This is what the players think you want to write this addon for.
What I as a tank mean is : KILL SKULL, FAST! INTERRUPT IT!

Its a killorder to reduce incoming dmg to help the healer.

I charge caster a (skull), rend, thunderclap and I have to trust my dmg team to take care that skull is dead before it can cast his deadly spells. Because I am already busy building aggro on caster b and melee c and interupt, disarm and whatever. All on targets you as a dps should not disturbe until you cast a cc, interupt, stun.

I'm a "wow teacher". That means I enjoy spending my time with your addons audience to help them improve because they understand what and when ability they should use. And I can tell you it would teach the wrong things.
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10-03-11, 10:34 PM   #15
Othgar
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As a tank I agree with Rilgamon, I don't always want DPS on my target I want them on skull, X, and so on, Especially since I tab target through a mob to maintain my threat levels across the whole mob.

As DPS, I still don't see the reliability of this addon. granted it can tell me when something procs but I can't click it to use that proc so I still need to hit a hotkey or click a button on my action bars. And as Tonyleila said what happens if I have to swicth off a boss mid fight to pick up DPS on adds.

As far as binding abilities to my mouse buttons like I do on my healer with Healbot, I just plain don't like it I guess. I turn with my mouse and use hotkeys on my keyboard for abilities. Only reason I can click to heal with my druid is that generally I don't have to move around a whole lot when healing, unless it's to not stand in fire, in which case I can move quickly and continue healing. Also not all players have 14+ button gaming mice to bind abilities to. Just counting abilities that I consistently use I have 28 keybindings between my keyboard and mouse. I would lose my mind trying to learn all those over again using just my mouse and modifier keys. And all that is only on one spec of one of my main toons. To try to learn all of that for each of my toons and each of their specs is simply more than I am willing to do for just one addon. I think that the learning curve would be incredibly steep, and to accomplish your goal of revolutionizing the DPS game, it would require people to learn a whole new way to play the game. Which most people are not willing to do, especially considering the time it would take to learn the addon, their DPS would surely suffer during that time, which in many high end raiding guilds could cost them their raid spot.

All that being said, don't let it discourage you from creating this addon. I am just one player, a casual player at that.
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10-04-11, 09:26 AM   #16
realista69
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Originally Posted by Haleth View Post
If I interpreted your post correctly, your addon is essentially an all in one:

- Target manager with built-in threat meter
- Buff/debuff timer
- Reactive ability alert

It sounds interesting, but bear in mind that the target manager won't be possible. You see, buttons cannot have their function changed while in combat due to restrictions set by Blizzard.
As far as the target manager goes, this design would only need to be set for the Focus of the tanks. Right now, with Role check the game identifies the tank from the rest of the dps there are macros which have been created since Cata which actually target who ever the tanks targets are. I was hoping that this function could be included into an addon instead of a mouse over or macro.

These side buttons are and should be configurable to either identify the tanks targets or Skull, X and so on.

Right now for building purposes the add on only needs to be the Center Button. This Center button needs to have attacks mapped to it with the cool down indicator similar to Healbot. This should be step one since up until any future updates the actual targets buttons could be included. What is important is to have a configurable add on with the spells and attacks for each class. This Center box would need to have the threat indicator included. Until the targets buttons on the side are done players can Beta this thing by choosing their own targets, the intent later is to further reduce the time it takes players to select a target and get their attacks rolling again. Optionally in the Beta the Upper box could be included to show when special abilities proc, this addition isnt necessary in the Beta but will get players aware of what attacks they could use with any cool downs their class may have.

Originally Posted by Rilgamon View Post
This is what the players think you want to write this addon for.
What I as a tank mean is : KILL SKULL, FAST! INTERRUPT IT!

Its a killorder to reduce incoming dmg to help the healer.

I charge caster a (skull), rend, thunderclap and I have to trust my dmg team to take care that skull is dead before it can cast his deadly spells. Because I am already busy building aggro on caster b and melee c and interupt, disarm and whatever. All on targets you as a dps should not disturbe until you cast a cc, interupt, stun.

I'm a "wow teacher". That means I enjoy spending my time with your addons audience to help them improve because they understand what and when ability they should use. And I can tell you it would teach the wrong things.
If I may clarify what would be in the design:

The player using DeepsBot would no doubt be targeting the tanks target up to a point, yes a Raid needs the Skull to die while the tanks charges to the next target to gain aggro. The thing I would like to make clear is the player would have the option of killing your last target by using the Center button to unleash their attacks. If they want to switch at anytime they could use the Left or the Right buttons to reselect the tanks target once the Skull is dead.

I see some of the points made here, I understand what each person is trying to say. I to have played this game since birth and after looking at the success of Healbot and the likes of similar addons I really cannot see this being anything less than a success. I simply would like to see this thing become a reality, let the player base be the judge, even a Beta would unlock a ton of answers and questions - which may inevitably bring this add on into a new direction.

Last edited by realista69 : 10-04-11 at 09:57 AM.
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10-04-11, 10:22 AM   #17
Rilgamon
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Just a quick question ... how many buttons do you want to put into the center ?

The spell and target of a button can not be changed during combat.
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10-04-11, 10:53 AM   #18
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I don't really understand, what you're up to...

Healbot doesn't work with "buttons", it shows unitframes and then triggers spells based on which mousebutton/modifier-combo you are using to click on them. Clique does the same.

And it is perfectly possible to bind attack-spells with clicks (I use HolyShock on my Pala for example by clicking the hostile target) using Clique.

So, basically you will need a unitframe-addon and Clique to make "the center button".
Move two ActionButtons left and right to this, bind the according macros to them and your addon is done, isn't it?

As you already were told, you can not alter an ActionButtons "action" while in combat. So you can't make an addon where you mindlessly click the same spot over and over again.

While I see the charm of your solution (may test this on my mage), I don't see any benefits for casual players, since they will have to memorize the bindings of their spells (speaking as Holy Paladin: Mouse1 = Heal1, Mouse2 = Heal2, Mouse5 = HolyShock, Mouse6 = Beacon, Mouse1+Alt = Decurse...).

You can of course include some kind of "rotation helper", but the player will have to use the right ability at the right time. If he "misclicks", the rotation is "ruined" and nothing is won.

Additionally, as far as I know, there is no way to target any unit by the assigned raid-icon. So, if you want to make this functionality work, I guess you will have to fetch the GUID while assigning the skull and when you want to re-target this unit, you will have to iterate through all units in range to find the skull again. I would think this will cause massive lag.

And, speaking as a main-tank: I want all members of my raid to be aware of the situation and do the right thing at the right time, just because they know what is going on. This way, the whole raid can react faster on surprising events.
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10-04-11, 12:41 PM   #19
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Here is what "buttons can't change target in combat" means. Every unit accessible by the UI is selected by a UnitID, for example, a SecureActionButton set to act on "maintanktarget" will stay on that UnitID. When the Main Tank switches targets, the UnitID points to the new target instead of the old one, therefore causing your button to update to the target change. There is no way to force the game to ignore this target update and stick to a single mob/player. What everyone means by "can't change targets in combat" is the UnitID the button points to is locked during combat and cannot be changed during that lockout period.

PS: I was certain Blizzard added a "maintank" UnitID, but I can't find any documentation on it or even usage of it in Blizzard code, anyone want to confirm this?
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10-04-11, 01:28 PM   #20
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No, there is the role "maintank" but no unitid. At least not that I know.
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WoWInterface » Developer Discussions » General Authoring Discussion » Looking for help in designing and creating a awesome addon

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