nUI -- A full feature standalone UI replacement

[Marthisdil]

Originally Posted by spiel2001 The only problem with that is that nUI would then be dependent on Databroker and nUI will never have a third party dependency.

Hmm - I don't think I was clear. Making nUI have the ability to display the DataBroker plugins, if available, isn't a dependency really - it would work the same way you utilize Omen or Recount if it's installed. nUI would work perfectly fine without either of those, and would work perfectly fine without any DataBroker addons installed.

From what i understand with DB - the library and plugins are designed completely separately from whatever mod is used to DISPLAY the plugins (be it a panel, or toolbar (like Titan/FuBar), etc).

I'll go and re-read all the info about DB, but that's how I was thinking it worked.

M

[Marthisdil]

Originally Posted by Seer It's QH, a friend of mine only has 2 mods installed, one of them is QH... She was told by blizzard that turning of QH should fix the problem, which apparently does. Edit; It can also be a problem with WoW or the nic, when there are to many toons running around the game and/or the nic gets to much data to handle and DC's you. Tho if it's a nic problem you usually lose all internet connections as well. Not sure if this problem is still relevant but it was in TBC and Shat..

It's not ONLY QH.

I don't use QH anymore. Every once in a while, I'll crash in Dalaran with some weird Texture Read from file error. To the point that when I log back in, it crashes again. I have to login with a copy of WoW with no UI mods installed at all, login, move away form the exact spot i was in, close out, login with my normal WoW.

It only happens in Dalaran. It's really strange.

[Marthisdil]

Originally Posted by Marthisdil Hmm - I don't think I was clear. Making nUI have the ability to display the DataBroker plugins, if available, isn't a dependency really - it would work the same way you utilize Omen or Recount if it's installed. nUI would work perfectly fine without either of those, and would work perfectly fine without any DataBroker addons installed. From what i understand with DB - the library and plugins are designed completely separately from whatever mod is used to DISPLAY the plugins (be it a panel, or toolbar (like Titan/FuBar), etc). I'll go and re-read all the info about DB, but that's how I was thinking it worked. M

Scott - looking at Tekkub's dev wiki about DataBroker it would seem that my thinking wasn't 100% correct.

It would seem that for a display mod to display LDB plugins, it does require the library. So in order for my thought to work, you would end up needing to have something conditional to check for the library, and if present, allow nUI to handle displaying of panels, etc. Would be pretty nice to have a plugin that would let us have a page (or pages) on the info panel where LDB plugins could be displayed.

Man, I keep coming up with ideas and need more addon dev experience

M

[Seer]

Originally Posted by Marthisdil It's not ONLY QH. I don't use QH anymore. Every once in a while, I'll crash in Dalaran with some weird Texture Read from file error. To the point that when I log back in, it crashes again. I have to login with a copy of WoW with no UI mods installed at all, login, move away form the exact spot i was in, close out, login with my normal WoW. It only happens in Dalaran. It's really strange.

I had QH installed and deleted it (not disabling it but deleted the mod) and still had some weird problems. These disappeared when I deleted the files related to QH in the WTF and it's sub directories.

Not saying it will solve your problem, but might be something you want to try out.


As a side note, any mods that does something similar to QH (Carbonite?) might cause problems as well, and I would guess mods that "inspect" other players may cause the game/nic to overload.. (With that said, nUI does read/inspect other players as well?).. doesn't sound logical to get a texture read error, but seen so many error messages that seem unrelated to the actual cause/problem or just plain dumb (program stopped because it stopped)..

[spiel2001]

I actually sent Kodewulf an e-mail this morning before I left for work and asked him if he would in interested in creating either a plugin for Databroker and nUI bars (sans Titan/FuBar) or even as an integration module for nUI. I'll check his response when I get home this evening.

Originally Posted by Marthisdil Scott - looking at Tekkub's dev wiki about DataBroker it would seem that my thinking wasn't 100% correct. It would seem that for a display mod to display LDB plugins, it does require the library. So in order for my thought to work, you would end up needing to have something conditional to check for the library, and if present, allow nUI to handle displaying of panels, etc. Would be pretty nice to have a plugin that would let us have a page (or pages) on the info panel where LDB plugins could be displayed. Man, I keep coming up with ideas and need more addon dev experience M

[Marthisdil]

Originally Posted by spiel2001 I actually sent Kodewulf an e-mail this morning before I left for work and asked him if he would in interested in creating either a plugin for Databroker and nUI bars (sans Titan/FuBar) or even as an integration module for nUI. I'll check his response when I get home this evening.

Scott - would it be possible for you to release a "blank" nUI Panel plugin for some of us who wish to explore to have a basis?

Basically something that adds a panel, a button, and comments on what is what?

I'd love to try and fiddle - but I have no idea on where to start with the nUI Panel system (I tried looking at the existing panels and plugins, but I think I confused myself lol).

I'd be happy to try and tackle making an nUI panel for LDB plugins if I could get that starting point.

M

[spiel2001]

I can do that.

However, the LDB plugins will not be implemented in the info panel. nUI has been designed from the get-go to have it's own top and bottom bars a la FuBar/Titan and that's where the LDB plugins would go (so nUI users could forgo using Titan and/or FuBar entirely with nUI since it would support LDB plugins directly)

Originally Posted by Marthisdil Scott - would it be possible for you to release a "blank" nUI Panel plugin for some of us who wish to explore to have a basis? Basically something that adds a panel, a button, and comments on what is what? I'd love to try and fiddle - but I have no idea on where to start with the nUI Panel system (I tried looking at the existing panels and plugins, but I think I confused myself lol). I'd be happy to try and tackle making an nUI panel for LDB plugins if I could get that starting point. M

[spiel2001]

I would like to get feedback from as many nUI users as possible on the subject of FPS issues. Please note... this survey applies ONLY if you are running nUI 4.13 or later.

Specifically...

1) Are you seeing major random FPS swings? Yes? No? How low?

2) Are they interfering with your game play? Yes? No? How so?

3) In what zones do you see these swings? Zone names.

4) Do you have FPS issues in non-raid instances? (or "I don't do instances")

5) Do you have FPS issues in Battelgrounds? (or "I don't do battlegrounds")

6) Do you have FPS issues in 25/40 man raids? (or "I don't raid")

7) If you disable just nUI leaving all other mods active and repeat the same activities in the same zones under the same conditions, do you still see *any* FPS drop? If yes, is it more or less than with nUI and how much so?

[Tamsiel]

I'm sure you already know my answers

1) Are you seeing major random FPS swings? Yes
How low? Down to 15fps from 40-90fps depending on what I have maxfps set at (once down to 0, but believe that to have been a unique situation)

2) Are they interfering with your game play? Yes
How so? Because when fps drops there's a second or two of not being able to do anything and has proven deadly in PvE and PvP most of the time.

3) In what zones do you see these swings? So far I've seen it in all zones a level 1-34 character can (safely, to a point..lol) play in.

4) Do you have FPS issues in non-raid instances? Yes

5) Do you have FPS issues in Battelgrounds? Yes

6) Do you have FPS issues in 25/40 man raids? I don't raid (yet)

7) If you disable just nUI leaving all other mods active and repeat the same activities in the same zones under the same conditions, do you still see *any* FPS drop? No

Thanks again for your great support and great UI!

[Sothie]

Originally Posted by spiel2001 Are you on a Mac, XP or Vista box? If you go back to the earlier nUI version, does it work then?

Hi Mate.

I use Vista,
And i just tried to install 4.13 and i still had the black textures there.

[Petrah]

1) Are you seeing major random FPS swings? Yes? No? How low?
No

2) Are they interfering with your game play? Yes? No? How so?
N/A

3) In what zones do you see these swings? Zone names.
N/A

4) Do you have FPS issues in non-raid instances? (or "I don't do instances")
No

5) Do you have FPS issues in Battelgrounds? (or "I don't do battlegrounds")
No

6) Do you have FPS issues in 25/40 man raids? (or "I don't raid")
No

7) If you disable just nUI leaving all other mods active and repeat the same activities in the same zones under the same conditions, do you still see *any* FPS drop? If yes, is it more or less than with nUI and how much so?
No

As you can see from the screenies (in the evening when prime time starts) in Dalaran I do not have FPS issues.

[Petrah]

Originally Posted by Marthisdil It's not ONLY QH. Every once in a while, I'll crash in Dalaran with some weird Texture Read from file error. To the point that when I log back in, it crashes again. I have to login with a copy of WoW with no UI mods installed at all, login, move away form the exact spot i was in, close out, login with my normal WoW. It only happens in Dalaran. It's really strange.

Is that error in the games Errors folder?

[spiel2001]

Originally Posted by Sothie Hi Mate. I use Vista, And i just tried to install 4.13 and i still had the black textures there.

Sothie -- Okay... I'm just about certain the issue is how WoW handles AddOns in Vista. Please check this thread and see if it resolves the issue(s) for you... http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...57867106&sid=1

[thebbandit]

spiel i would like to say that i love your addon and it works great for me! even though at times the fps can hit some lows, while im in 25 os or 25naxx it seems to dip a lot while everyone is in burn mode. this question is not in that regard though, as i have a query about the spell cooldown display, is there anything different about priest spell cooldowns? i saw in a picture you posted cooldowns for spells that have +10 second cooldowns. i was wondering if i could turn on the display of things like my shadowfiend, shadow word: death, mindblast or dispersion. even a prayer of mending cooldown and power word: shield for the healers out there. i looked through the command list and i couldn't find anything of the nature.

[spiel2001]

There was a cooldown bar in nUI until Beta 3 when I had to remove it due to changes in the Bliz API. It is coming back very soon. This weekend I hope, but don't promise. For now, however, it's not that you're missing anything, it's just not implemented in the current release.

Originally Posted by thebbandit spiel i would like to say that i love your addon and it works great for me! even though at times the fps can hit some lows, while im in 25 os or 25naxx it seems to dip a lot while everyone is in burn mode. this question is not in that regard though, as i have a query about the spell cooldown display, is there anything different about priest spell cooldowns? i saw in a picture you posted cooldowns for spells that have +10 second cooldowns. i was wondering if i could turn on the display of things like my shadowfiend, shadow word: death, mindblast or dispersion. even a prayer of mending cooldown and power word: shield for the healers out there. i looked through the command list and i couldn't find anything of the nature.

[spiel2001]

Tamsiel --

I am absolutely not disputing that you're experiencing FPS drops because I know for a fact they are occurring. What bothers me is that I cannot duplicate your assertion that without nUI enabled you are experiencing no FPS drops.

If I disable ALL mods I am seeing frame rates swing between 24fps and 85fps doing NOTHING except walking around the woods... no spells casting, no cooldowns, etc. Just the plain vanilla WoW UI and being outdoors.

I will agree that the frame rates are lower with nUI enabled than without, but it would be impossible for them not to be lower as there's no way to write a complete UI and not have it use more CPU than not having it. But I just cannot for the life of me find frame rate dips in nUI that don't exist in the default Bliz UI.

All the same, please know I am doing everything I can to continue to reduce nUI's impact on the CPU and GPU wherever possible... and any all input that helps pinpoint particular actions or events that reliably cause FPS drops will be most appreciated.

Check out these two screencaps of just the Bliz UI with no mods noting that neither is the highest or lowest frame rates I saw walking around, they're just representative. The third screencap is just nUI loaded in the same area...

.

[Tamsiel]

Originally Posted by spiel2001 Tamsiel -- I am absolutely not disputing that you're experiencing FPS drops because I know for a fact they are occurring. What bothers me is that I cannot duplicate your assertion that without nUI enabled you are experiencing no FPS drops.

I probably shouldn't have said no, but instead said that there is fluctuation but it does not impact game play as it does when I run nUI. And as I've stated before all the other UI's I've tried not one of them has had a similar fps effect.

But I just cannot for the life of me find frame rate dips in nUI that don't exist in the default Bliz UI.

I don't know. I know with the plain jane UI and with other UI's I haven't seen my fps drop below 25, even when in Stormwind or Ironforge. And again with the Bliz UI and other UI's I've not had a noticeable framerate drop happen while in combat, yet once the fps starts falling and rising in nUI it happens almost every time in combat (PvE and BG's) -- and usually results in a death .

All the same, please know I am doing everything I can to continue to reduce nUI's impact on the CPU and GPU wherever possible... and any all input that helps pinpoint particular actions or events that reliably cause FPS drops will be most appreciated.

I know you are and greatly appreciate it. I think nUI is by far, hands down, the best UI out there for how I play and don't plan on giving up on it Anything I can think of that may help pinpoint the issue I'll be sure to provide to you.

Thank you.

[thebbandit]

i agree with what you are saying, today i dissabled all my addons, except for nui and it was a great improvement! it wasn't nui but quest helper and all the other addons i have like atlas and cartographer that i think were the culprit, today i did 25 man naxx and it was beautiful with a refresh around 15 - 20, which is good for me in a 25man. i appreciate all the feedback you give on these forums and i hope you dont think i am accusing your addon of being a system hog, because its not. i was just saying that when the action gets a little intense i have dips, not saying they are directly related to the ui. PS i think implementing the LDB into your ui would be amazing

[spiel2001]

No worries... I'm never concerned that anyone is "accusing" nUI of anything ~smile~ But when there are issues, I need to get to the bottom of them and one of the hardest things is trying to determine the source of the problem. Particularly when you can't touch or see the machine that's having the problem firsthand and have to rely on someone else, less experienced, to do it for you.

Being a software engineer for over 30 years now, I have a decent set of skills at troubleshooting. But all the same, in an environment like WoW, there is so much complexity and so many potential variables it can be very difficult to isolate where a problem is coming from. So I can tend to be a tad anal about the questions I ask users because any variation from the point changes the answers.

As I said before, I know for certain there are FPS dips and I know for certain that your FPS will be at least a little bit lower with nUI than without because it simply isn't physicaly possible for it not to be. I am at least fairly certain that somewhere in nUI are a couple of places where I do contribute notably to FPS slowdowns and I'm working to identify and fix them.

However, I am equally certain that nUI is not the source of the FPS issues everyone is having now, if only because they exist running no mods at all.

Originally Posted by thebbandit i agree with what you are saying, today i dissabled all my addons, except for nui and it was a great improvement! it wasn't nui but quest helper and all the other addons i have like atlas and cartographer that i think were the culprit, today i did 25 man naxx and it was beautiful with a refresh around 15 - 20, which is good for me in a 25man. i appreciate all the feedback you give on these forums and i hope you dont think i am accusing your addon of being a system hog, because its not. i was just saying that when the action gets a little intense i have dips, not saying they are directly related to the ui. PS i think implementing the LDB into your ui would be amazing

[neuralassassin]

hey spiel i know the bagbar bugs been reported. i ran into something real wierd with it its like the mover is extending the frame instead of moving it if that makes sense. i didnt know if these screen shots might help i never had a problem moving it till just recently now i have to move it then turn visibility off and then reload which is when the extended thing happens if you need any more info let me know
thanks
ps oh i forgot i can only move it left and right too