Official forums: Real names only

[voodoodad]

And the clear sound of a silver trumpet peels out in the golden dawn sky, playing taps for the official forums. And maybe for WoW itself if as many people quit the game as are saying they did there...

[Petrah]

Going back through some old links I saved in my browser, a lot of those posts have been pruned (I had saved them when I was volunteering so that I could show the links to people who would throw tantrums and demand support). You can find them cached in Google if you really want to set aside the time it would take to look. You will also noticed that the old timers (volunteers that have been there forever) will say those words, and not one single tech will correct them. I most certainly wouldn't state that those words were said if they had not been.

Your access to these forums is a “privilege,” and not a “right.”

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/forum-coc.html

"Your subscription fees help us to maintain customer support"

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...12&pageNo=3#51

[seebs]

"Got in touch with my ex-flatmate, whose sister works as a GM for Blizzard, to see what the internal buzz on this was. Apparently, at the moment the employees are largely as pissed as the players, and she stated that despite attempts to keep it hushed, it has become known that the big creative players within Blizzard are pretty much as unhappy about this as we are. Everybody has been told they are not free to comment on this situation outside of specially prepared statements.

It’s still going ahead, however (and here’s where in-house rumours and hearsay really start coming into play): from what they’ve picked up, the Blizzard leads have been told in no uncertain terms that the non-gameplay-related direction of the game is working to a different blueprint now. GC and company are free to play with shiny new talent trees all they like, for example, but for the first time the decisions regarding Battle.net implementation, Real ID, and plans for the general acquisition of new players for the business are no longer in Blizzard’s own hands, and that’s not going down too well."

Someone posted this, but it got deleted. Can't imagine why.

[Sythalin]

Originally Posted by seebs "Got in touch with my ex-flatmate, whose sister works as a GM for Blizzard, to see what the internal buzz on this was. Apparently, at the moment the employees are largely as pissed as the players, and she stated that despite attempts to keep it hushed, it has become known that the big creative players within Blizzard are pretty much as unhappy about this as we are. Everybody has been told they are not free to comment on this situation outside of specially prepared statements. It’s still going ahead, however (and here’s where in-house rumours and hearsay really start coming into play): from what they’ve picked up, the Blizzard leads have been told in no uncertain terms that the non-gameplay-related direction of the game is working to a different blueprint now. GC and company are free to play with shiny new talent trees all they like, for example, but for the first time the decisions regarding Battle.net implementation, Real ID, and plans for the general acquisition of new players for the business are no longer in Blizzard’s own hands, and that’s not going down too well." Someone posted this, but it got deleted. Can't imagine why.

When the merger was first announced, I said two things. And I quote:

Activision destroys everything they touch, WoW will be no different.

WoW used to be fun, but with this merger it's going to become all about the money and little about the game.

I don't mean to pat my own back, but I'm not the only one who shared this opinion at that time. Looks like the naysayers have it this time.

[Ferous]

Originally Posted by Petrah Your access to these forums is a “privilege,” and not a “right.” http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/forum-coc.html "Your subscription fees help us to maintain customer support" http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...12&pageNo=3#51

This is exactly what i was told Petrah, and I relayed it to the wow forums in this debate about the forums being apart of the game.

I was told these quotes when I was perma banned from the forums :O

Oh well

[seebs]

Yup, you called it.

So, now I just need to find a new hobby. Ideally one that I can do as co-op multiplayer with my friends. Must have 100% optional PvP or none at all.

[voodoodad]

/sigh

O-forum thread is nearing 3000 pages and 50000 posts. Granted, many of the posts are repeat offenders (such as myself) but still... No responses from Blizz or Activision (as I believe they are the ones now running the show).

I'm pretty sure they'll end up saying the protesters are a very small minority of WoW players and therefore they are completely justified in carrying out their plans.

Unfortunately that statement is true. What it doesn't take into account is that a very small minority of players actually post in the forums. The majority of the minority (if that makes sense) are the ones protesting the change. This should count for something. I was one of the people who rarely posted there, as I've said before, but my worries are more for what the future holds. They've disregarded their own statements regarding how and where RealID was going to be used. ie "it should be used only with family members and friends you know in real life". For now it remains voluntary in-game (which I support and use)... How long before it's required to play? If that happens, even though I do use it, I would cancel my account. It shouldn't be a requrement in-game, or in the forums.

[seebs]

And they're handing out bans like pvp epics for people who criticize it now... Woo!

I don't have any confidence that they won't make it mandatory elsewhere, but even if they only did it to the forums... i have friends who will be unable to safely post to the forums, while kids who make fun of victims of sexual assault will be actively encouraged to stay in the forums, because they're comfortable giving out their real names. Uncool.

[voodoodad]

Originally Posted by seebs And they're handing out bans like pvp epics for people who criticize it now... Woo! I don't have any confidence that they won't make it mandatory elsewhere, but even if they only did it to the forums... i have friends who will be unable to safely post to the forums, while kids who make fun of victims of sexual assault will be actively encouraged to stay in the forums, because they're comfortable giving out their real names. Uncool.

I guess I haven't been loud enough over there to be thrown under the ban-hammer... Yet
Still, every time I go back there it gets more and more depressing. To see a once great company like Blizz talking about "social gaming". Uggg. I'll go to facebook if I want a social experience. I play WoW to get away from the real world...

[Seerah]

I would like to remind people that most likely the CMs on the official forums cannot say anything one way or the other on the subject. I am 99.9% certain that they are relaying feedback, it just may take time to get that feedback up the chain, then time for whomever is in charge re. RealID to discuss a decision, and then more time for that decision to be given to the CMs to be put on the forums. They may be talking with PR folks, with their lawyers, with their bosses, with their employees... We don't know. All we can do is wait. Wait and try to stay positive.

[Dawn]

What a mess.

I can only hope that this uproar will come to a good ending. The realID stuff bugged me since the first second I heard about it. As long as it won't touch the game itself much more than it does already, I might be able to live with it. I'm really pissed though, stupid social networking ****, really.

[seebs]

Word is, it doesn't matter -- the decision was made by people at Activision, and the blues are at least as unhappy as we are, because pretty much all of them view this as a horrible betrayal of their customers, unsurprisingly, and they are pretty much miserable to discover that Activision is allowed to dictate terms on stuff like this.

But that also means that there does not exist any possible feedback which would change anything.

I think it's over. I'm looking around to find other MMOs or games I could put my time into. The only way this will improve will be if Blizzard ends up getting spun off by Activision, or if they do what Infinity Ward did and walk.

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by Petrah You will also noticed that the old timers (volunteers that have been there forever) will say those words, and not one single tech will correct them. I most certainly wouldn't state that those words were said if they had not been.

That wasn't what I was trying to refute at all.

Your statement was I believe "Forum support isn't guaranteed only phone based support is".

That's what I was attempting to refute.

I pointed out to you that not even Tech Support is guaranteed to us. Take a very close look at your TOS and EULA to see exactly what you pay for.

My point was both forms of customer support are technically not paid for yet Blizzard still pays for it being provided to us as a extra perk of what you pay for.

Some of the time phone based support is better equipped to handle a customer's issue while other times ticket based support is the best. Sometimes it's better to post on the forums and other times it's best to send an email.

That's the only thing I had an issue with. The "guaranteed" part of your words. Please quote them again if I've read you wrong. "guaranteed" in which way Petrah my dear

"Guaranteed" as in you will definitely get a direct response from a Live person ? Sure. You either talk to a person on the phone or you don't. Blizzard doesn't have a IVR system customers can use to solve issues on their account.

Originally Posted by Zeppy the wonder skull Originally Posted by Some random forum goer Whats point of paid race change/faction change/server transfer/change name... imo, our $15 monthly should involve those for free These features simply aren't included with your subscription fees. The monthly subscription rate didn't increase once these options were added. None of the paid services are necessary to play the game as advertised. Your subscription fees help us to maintain customer support, developing new content for each patch cycle, connect to and maintain our realms, allow us to store your account/character data, etc.

Fuller quote there for you

Holding my head to the side and reading between the lines this isn't saying your subscription fees pay directly for customer support. Only that they help pay for it. That is IMHO.

Saying a customer pays for something and the money you get off them "helps pay for it" are two different things. The first is guaranteed to you as a customer other is a slight perk. It's almost like he's saying your sub. fees help pay for his morning coffee or the mortgage fees on the cool campus they have in orange country.

My forum post in the Tech Support forums was a lot more direct then that. A lot more. In was pretty much a post asking according to the Terms of Service and End User License exactly what does our subscription fee pay for ? . It was more of a post wanting clarification on the legal aspects more then anything.

Also if you've read down this far don't take any of this as a personal attack against you. I've been told I think differently to other people and are sometimes quite eccentric.

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by seebs Word is, it doesn't matter -- the decision was made by people at Activision

Haven't read anything directly attributing the forum change to Activision yet

But that also means that there does not exist any possible feedback which would change anything.

Oh there's definitely been some strong back lash against it.

What grates me is there are forum regulars that have been loyal to Blizzard since the Warcraft 1.0 days. People who have unofficially provided help & support to the community for free for years. People that have written plenty of good helpful posts including FAQs, Guides, Long threads about particular issues and how to solve it, Much of the stuff on wow wiki,Unofficial documentation on how to write macros and possibly 95% of the resources used by addon programmers that Blizzard have not written.

And these people are saying to Blizzard "you do this and we walk. Out that door. And we are NEVER coming back".

These are the people that give free support to their customer base when no reps are online. These are the people you see in forums still helping someone even after they've thrown a tantrum or wobbly. These are people that will go out of your way to give you advice even work related advice.

No I think Blizzard have an excellent opportunity here.

It's an opportunity to step back and admit to the customer that whatever reasoning they had for putting real names on the forums was a bad decision.

To admit that maybe in the future a change this concerning to people probably should of been polled in some way. Get some outside feedback from your customers before you make a major business decision. Yes it may look all amazing and cool in your own head but at the end of the day it's the customer that has to pony up the $$ to play the game. If they're not happy and not going to pay for it then all the best design meeting decisions go out the window as it's not meeting what the customer needs.

Here's wowace's 404 cute kitty page. This is what Blizzard needs to do :

You will note however at this stage to my knowledge that huge thread has yet to be thread locked. That the post cap has been increased again and again. It's currently at 2298 pages and still climbing.

[seebs]

The impression I get is that if half the players cancelled, Kotick would push on forwards "because this is the only way we can make up for losing that user base".

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by seebs The impression I get is that if half the players cancelled, Kotick would push on forwards "because this is the only way we can make up for losing that user base".

That's losing sight of the issue.

Where is he going to get his new customers from ? Partially from the sector of society that he's just alienated.

Also how's a new player can feel when they find out they can only post on the forums with their real name.

"Oh it was nice but now that I have this issue that my other avenues of support can't solve i have to cancel now ... was nice while it lasted"

It may get you a new customer for a few days or even months. But it just doesn't build customer loyality.

[VincentSDSH]

I've been thinking lately about this and doing something I hadn't contemplated before: quitting. To be honest, if it was just my wife and I, we'd have canceled already over this but it's more complicated than that -- price of running a guild that's getting on to 14yrs old and prides itself on being family.

I'm not a fanboy of Blizzard -- respected them as a company, enjoyed their games, but the game mattered and I've played too many games in my time and I'm jaded and cynical and I enjoyed that those aspects of me didn't need a lot of air-time in WoW.

The stupidity of this forced Real ID thing are self-evident to anyone with a single working brain-cell, as is the simple perma-nickname solution. Why not implement it? At this point "ulterior motive" is the only answer I can come up with.

All that said, to my mind Blizzard's reputation will be forever marred, no matter how they play it. Facebook took a trashing (deservedly so and they weren't beaten up nearly to the degree they deserve) and their reputation will be linked with "disdain for customer's desire for privacy vs Zucker's thirst for money." Blizzard may yet turn this around and play a bit of a hero but, let's face it, the trust factor is forever lost.

The surprising thing is that, after all I've been through, Blizzard actually built up some trust for me to lose.

/sad day-one-collector's-edition panda

[Sythalin]

Taking a moment to analyze the situation, it doesn't matter how much people protest. If they were to try and retract the system (which has been made clear will not happen, but hold on to that hope if you wish) it would most likely push back the release of SC2, which is due out on the 27th. No "real" (I use the term VERY loosely at this point) company would release this type of game with the forums to help "support" their players.

In short, it's coming, it's not changing and they're going to lose some business. Unfortunately, it won't be nearly enough to matter.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go grab some popcorn and wait for the show to begin when the first lawsuit comes from someone who got their ass beat after being tracked by their RealID.

[Bluspacecow]

Originally Posted by ChaosInc Taking a moment to analyze the situation, it doesn't matter how much people protest. If they were to try and retract the system (which has been made clear will not happen, but hold on to that hope if you wish) it would most likely push back the release of SC2, which is due out on the 27th. No "real" (I use the term VERY loosely at this point) company would release this type of game with the forums to help "support" their players.

They don't need to push back the SC2 release date to fix this.

Just the change to the new forums requiring Real ID to post. They could push back their implementation of the new forums while they code something into place so you could use a pseudo name.

They could then slot this into their patch release schedule somewhere for both SC2 , their forums and the new world of warcraft forums.

[voodoodad]

I originally posted this in the O-forums, but I would like you guys to have a look at it too (especially in a place where it won't get buried in a tidal wave of other posts);

Let's face it... Trolls will be trolls whether their real names are attached to their posts or not. There won't be any more accountability after RealID is instituted than there ever has been. Trolls for the most part are in their mid-teens and haven't learned any kind of social skills whatsoever. Simple politeness is beyond them. They don't get it and probably never will interact well with people after years of posting pure dreck in forums such as these. They won't care if their real-life names are revealed, because there will never be any accountability. If if Blizzard can't keep them out of the forums now, when they already know their names, how is the posting of their real names supposed to clean things up? Are the few normal, non-trolling, people who are left after the change supposed to police the forums and start harassing trolls in real life? Is this what ActiBlizz wants? The whole 'Anti-troll' argument falls to pieces when you look at it this way. If I, a person of middling intellect, can figure this out then you must know that ActiBlizz has. Therefore there has to be another motive behind the move. Money. Facebook+Activision+Blizzard = the almighty dollar. The hints have been there for months. Most of us just haven't looked deeply enough. It's almost like the politically correct movement... The words "Massive Multi-Player Role Playing Game" have been replaced with terms like "Social Gaming Experience" and words like "Player" are being reworked into "Online Virtual Reality Consumer". Bah! I want no part of an 'SGE'! I don't want to be an 'OVRC'! I want my GAME back! At this point I'm wishing that some company (not Blizzard, and CERTAINLY not Activision) would develop an MMORPG for the PS3. So far the words "Social Gaming Experience" haven't touched that platform at least...